Comments from (mostly) Guy S.
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This page of commentary was originally initiated by Anders of Sweden, but had substantial follow-up commentary from Guy S. of the United States. It began after Anders had found my750.com, then he asked members of the Forum what they thought. Some incidental remarks have been left out.
Anders asks the Forum:
Does your E38 cause you trouble? Hi everyone!
I surfed in on this guys homepage with all of those horrorstories about the
750. Several people confirmed it both on the E32 and the E38 models. This
scares me a bit. Do I dare to put my money on a 1995 740 E38? Athese
babies really haunted with lots of trouble? (I mean more than an average
persons standard vehicle, all cars fail from time to time..) I am aware
of the sulphur-problem, but that's mainly a US-problem, I'm from Sweden but
I'm picking up the car in Germany.
Sweden - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 01:41:22
Tjena! Hur gaare'? Jeg er Norsk, men bor i USA.
The sulphur problem is not a problem in the 750, only V8 1993-1995. In my opinion,
the cars are somewhat haunted with electrical gremlins and other small things.
However, any car like this will be expensive to keep, and the pleasure of owning
one far outweighs the cost and occasional problem. My car is a 95' 740i,
and I love it. I can only imagine how a 750 would be ;) I would be wary of importing
a german car though. In Norway there are hordes of BMW, Mercedes, Audi, and
other cars imported as used cars from Germany. They generally have a very low
second-hand value in the market when time comes to sell them. People are somewhat
afraid of cars that are from Germany, because they are driven much harder (daily
trips on the Autobahn, you know). Anyway, if you find a nice one at a
decent price, I bet you'll fall in love and never look back - and you'll deal
with whatever problems may arise without hesitation. My two cents (eller
Big-T (1995 740i) <email address on file)
Norway - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 06:55:01
Anders, My 3& 1/2 Pfennings worth..
I assume Axel's website is accurate, and if it is, I think his experience, while
not unique, is an exceptional one. To buy or not buy a 740 because of Axel's
experience is in my view, folly. The world wide web has many sites similar in
content, and for any brand of car you name. Were we to avoid a brand of automobile
because there was a lemon produced somewhere, we would need to get used to walking.
To a certain extent a cars condition is a reflection of it's design, it's age,
it's maintainence history, and the things it's owner asks of it. How much of
Axel's site listed NORMAL WEAR & TEAR? How much of his complaint was due
to a poor service organization at the dealership? Speaking for myself,
my 740il is, and acts like, the world class sport sedan she is. Since I use
her at race tracks, I realize she needs more attention than if I were just riding
in her, and it is my obligation to see to it that the attention is given. I
do not take the attitude that, "Hey, I spent $70,000.00 on this car &
my brakes shouldn't squeak". Brakes squeak, even expensive ones.
Mr. Axel's story is certainly the stuff of legend. I wish him & the others
on his site, good luck in resolving the issues they have with their cars. My
warning to them is that, It can happen again & with a different brand of
car. My philosophy is these cars are to be DRIVEN. You want to "ride
around"? Get a Benz. Since I ask my car to be civil on the street and furious
at the track, I feel it would be a mistake to rely on the Mfr. recommended service.
My car and the things I do with her demand more resource & I cannot complain
about the cost. Thanks for listening
Simeon, aka Bimmerhead (740iL) <email address on file>
Friday, May 18, 2001 at 07:07:02
Well Said Simeon !...hey... the only thing
that kinda cracked me up was that 70,000 bucks issue....... the bottomline is:
you DO, (at some stage in life) say that when you pay peanuts you get monkeys...
right ? :-))) i mean, the LITTLE things in a car are the things that define
quality too... or maybe its just a different perspective on things ? however...
that was well written ! Cheers,
Lebanon - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 07:45:42
Guy replies to Anders' question:
How should one put it....Axel is a rich, stupid, pyhorreal man w/ no working brain! [italics indicate Guy using the name identity space allotment for the second half of his subject heading instead]
Axel showed up about a month ago selling his brand of crap, and hoping for a sympathetic ear. In a nutshell he is whining because he spends 20 large on a e32 750iL and then proceeds to spend 23,000 in 2 years on repairs and claims he needs another 10 before the car is completely cured. All the repairs are carried out by the same BMW dealership. Who else has 4 radiators installed in 2 years, caused by not getting a coolant tank cap which was under recall? Everyone else with e31/e32/e34/e36 all know about the recall. Where the hell was Axel. Probably recounting his gold. It all comes down to Axel being incompetent compounded by the dealerships incompetence having to rerepair the car over and over again for the same difficulty. I only wish I had his kind of dough while writing blank checks out while morons destroy the car. Axel is totally against working on the car himself and was completely surprised at the rebuffs the e32 board gave him. Nobody felt sorry for someone who NEVER questioned the competency of the dealership. In fact his responses to the suggestion that the dealership was ripping him off was met with denial and total support for the knowledgeable staff who are now 23,000 dollars wealthier. As I recall, the car when he purchased it was new enough to qualify for the extended warranty to carry him through 100K. Did he buy it? NO!
Mr. Anders, nobody from the e32 board confirmed
Axels point of view that the 750iL is a lemon, far from it. Yes we agreed it's
complicated, parts are expensive relative to other wheeled machines, but never
did we capitulate that the entire package is a rolling garbage heap sending
us all into the poor house. Most of us would gladly spend what ever funds it
required to maintain it. See the difference is we have power in knowledge due
to a society of about 250 expert mechanics on the e38,e32,e34,e31 boards to
assist with engine, suspension, chassis, interior, and whatever else goes wrong.
Collectively we have forgotten more than any networked dealership will ever
know about these cars, because we are a motivated group who loves the cars we
have. To Axel it's merely transportation. He'd do just as well with a YUGO.
Once you watch a given board for 6 months or so all the same complaints resurface.
Sure new/fresh information is always coming through but there's only so much
stuff on these cars to begin with and in parts alone, not including my labor,
I can virtually replace the ENTIRE engine,transmission, and every rotating piece
of mechanical drive train, and suspension component in a 7 series car for 23,000.00.
I won't deny for a nanosecond that a 7 series is cheap to maintain, ESPECIALLY IF YOU PAY SOMEONE ELSE TO WORK ON IT. But if you refuse to get your hands dirty, and can't give a dealership carteblanche' to "just fix it" you have no business owning a 7.
If you want a 7, don't run out and buy one and then start asking questions. Go through the archives week by week and learn about this car your going to buy and find out what types of maintenance are required. This may take a couple of months. Don't worry there are plenty of 7's around. Go have the car inspected by a competent independent who routinely works on these cars. Or do like I did. I learned enough in 4 months of board lurking that I inspected the cars myself.
I'm so upset about these "V12 LEMONS" that I have 2 92 750iL's and just looked at a 92 white 850i yesterday. The 8 was perfect and out of my price range at 30K. I've decided to get a problem 8 and fix it myself and save about 10-13k on the initial acquisition cost. See this way I spend the 10k on parts and renew the areas which tend to wear out anyway and I have a perfect car when I'm done.
If I've offending anyone with this hostile post, good! Hopefully it will shock some people to think for themselves and not buy into Axels line of swill. I won't be gracious enough to apologize as I've said nothing which requires such. Axel is one stupid guy and deserves all that misery! I told him to spend the other 10 grand and keep the car, at least this way he won't have pissed it all away for nothing which is exactly what will happen if he sells. He's got the money.
After rereading you post I see you've already got a 7 on the way. Don't you worry. You just post here and we'll help you out with all your inquiries. Yes, count on some repairs. But if you don't mind picking up a screwdriver and a wrench you'll be fine. But you have that car inspected before you bring it home!
Welcome aboard. You'll find a 7 series is a wonderful experience.
Guy S. (two 1992 750iL cars) <email address on file>
USA - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 08:50:34
Axel responds to Guy's remarks:
Pyhorreal man? What dictionary are YOU using? Perhaps Guy, you would be good enough to define "pyhorreal," which I have not found anywhere. Is this English? Give us our vocabulary lesson for the day.
First, I am only here to address the 750iL, not any other BMW models, with which I have no quarrel. I recognize that I am (hopefully) in the minority- that most people do have a good experience with their 750, however, there is an undeniable group of us who have not. You can call us "stupid" or "rich," but that doesn't explain the many similar stories involving the 750iL. And a minority group does have the right to be heard, particularly when others might benefit from the disclosure.
At the same time, members of this Forum should acknowledge that they too are in the minority. I would venture to guess that by far the majority of the people buying a 750iL, or a 7 series for that matter, are not able or willing to work on their car. Obviously, such individuals are in a different category, and a car that might normally (for most people) be unreasonable to maintain, becomes possible.
Any car requiring its owner to be a qualified
mechanic would indicate to me there is something inherently wrong with the car.
That's like saying you have to be a plumber to own a house, or a pilot to be
a passenger in an airplane. If you happen to be a mechanic, interested and capable
of working on your car, then good for you, but that's not for everyone. I commend
all of you on your repair skills, and this Board is a fantastic resource for
all those who are maintaining their own car, but it is absurd to assert that
being a mechanic is a prerequisite to owning a 7 series. I think BMW would be
horrified to hear of that conclusion. There has also been the incorrect assumption
that I have never done any work on the car myself. I have picked up a screwdriver
and wrench many times with it, but I have not done any major work on the car,
certainly not the repairs requiring proprietary diagnostic instruments, or repair
mechanisms I simply don't have access to.
"...if you refuse to get your hands dirty...you have no business owning a 7." Guy
To be unwilling to accept the fact that there are BMW owners NOT interested in being self-mechanics is unrealistic, and calling that majority segment "stupid" is in itself stupid and prejudiced.
Guy, your facts are mostly wrong. You may want
to reread my website. I'm not looking for sympathy, but a sharing of information.
Sympathy will not fix my car or repay my expenses. It was $23,000 over four
years, not two. $32,000 is the total amount spent on the car, combining the
prior owner's expenditures, not just mine. You also seem to ignore that the
$32,000 represents more than 100 visits to the shop. Forget about the money-
what about the frequency of the repairs? All repairs were not carried out by
the same dealership- the car was serviced in no less than 5 places, and work
was shopped around. It was four radiators in four years, not two years. Yes,
the radiator cap was replaced, according to the recall notice- see repair #86.
And you'll notice that two weeks later, repair #88, I had a coolant leak (and
the repair was not at the dealership). And repair #98 is radiator #4, a year
after the recall cap. I don't know how you can conclude the car's four radiators
were because of a faulty cap. I wasn't surprised in the slightest by the commentary
back from this Board- in fact, I thought it was rather mild; I anticipated worse.
I did have some very intelligent and thoughtful responses. The competency of
the dealership was always a consideration- these mechanics are highly qualified
and experienced with the 750iL, but they can't change the underlying characteristics
of the car. Sure, there are some expected higher prices involved, but having
the car worked on at a "stealer" is not the answer for everything
that has gone wrong with the car. I don't believe that my car was eligible for
a BMW extended warranty at the time I purchased it- perhaps from a 3rd party,
which I did look into and it was $2500 per year for limited coverage, which
would have been $10,000 over the last four years, and wouldn't haven't helped
me with what has gone wrong after 100,000 miles. People from this Forum DID
confirm my point of view, although they admittedly were in the minority. Some
highlights from Forum members, while they love their car, still had these things
"So, what's your point? They're all that way..." Lin G.
"...the E32 is the most over-plumbed, under-cooled (component wise), crapped up, cluttered design I have ever seen..." Steve
"What are you taking about, I take mine to the dealer too. I totally agree with him..." JJP
"...your content is nothing different from what many of us owners have experienced..." Fareed
My contention has never been that the 750iL is a "...rolling garbage heap sending us all into the poor house." In fact, on the home page of my750.com I continue to say, "Make no mistake- the 750iL is quite a car and I'm still impressed by it..." And if the car was "merely transportation" for me, I would have dumped it a long time ago. How else can you explain that I am still driving it?
I think all of you are too focused on my 750 experience. I have tried to steer the attention away from my 750, and more towards other stories about the 750, which are more serious than mine, none more so than Oliver's $134,000 2000 750iL Protection, which has been in the shop 112 days! Is he "stupid?" I seriously doubt it. I would like to think I could buy a 2000 or 2001 750iL, and it would be problem free, but a story like Oliver's makes me wonder if the car really is ready for release to the consumer market.
To Bimmerhead- Yes, there are other lemon car websites, but none that I have found that specifically identifies a particular model of a car and has other stories that mirror the experience, and not just from one year, but from the entire span of the model, 1988-2000. If you know of a single other website like mine, I would be interested in hearing about it. My philosophy is also that these cars be "driven," and I certainly do drive mine, but I am unfortunately not on a track where I can make regular pit stops- wish I were. Not all 750iL cars were meant to be driven- Oliver had his airbag deploy on his 2000 750iL Protection, when he first took his car to high speed! That is just not acceptable.
To Anders- I am not trying to proclaim that all 750iL cars or every BMW is bad- not at all. I have had four other BMWs. What I have noticed, as a two-time 750 owner and trading stories with other 750 owners, is that some of the 750 cars have phenomenal repair records, unique to the 750iL. Not the 740i, not the 740iL, but the 750iL, which I believe is in a category all its own. I have chosen to bring to light both what others and I have experienced. Do with that information what you like. If it increases awareness, good. If it makes BMW take notice and perhaps pay closer attention to the 750iL, even better.
While at first glance it may appear as though I am just trying to put down the 750iL, you are missing the point of my website. I want BMW to improve the design, manufacturing, assembly, and support for the 750iL. It's a car that deserves better.
Axel - 1989 750iL (formerly a 1988 750iL owner)
USA - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 17:45:36
A Forum member calling himself "747" reacts to Guy's comments:
HEY GUY SIMPSON
As Far as I can tell Axel posted here about his experience and opinions on a car, while you got personal, vulgar and rude right upfront. If I missed something and this is not accurate please disregard this comment. If not, I also found your choice of makine your message by using the poster name field very freudian (or were you actually referring to yourself as "pyhorreal man w/ no working brain!".
BMW, perhaps more so than other car makers can and does put out lemons. And when it does it blatantly and unashamedly disowns them adding insult to injury with their (and the dealers) attitude and treatment of any customer that question the service.
In cases like this a little overzealousness on the part of injured party is more than justified.
Clearly you have never been had by a dealer or stuck with a lemon(or never saw it coming).
I love BMW's, have had 3 so far and number 2 was a lemon.
I had to endure hearing from several BMW people for 3 months that my complaint was quote "a harmmonic vibration inherent to high performance engineering" until the factory rep actually agreed to get in my car which he only let roll about 50' before he abruptly got out and uttered the imortal words "we'll have the clutch and transmission replaced". Not an apology for 3 months of attitude. I didn't make my hassles public (website etc) but I too fell for the temptation to hang on to it because..."after all this money what else could possibly go wrong?".
So, if indeed you were gratuitously assaulting this poster for voicing his grievance you should instead apologize and thank him because it is thanks to people like him, not the likes of you, that companies like BMW learn from their mistakes and become more responsive to its customers.
And yes I still love my bimmer and it's probably not the last one I'll have
USA - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 18:29:40
Axel, in all fairness, I do think Guy was a little
harsh, but he did have some good points, which led me to express my agreement.
"I tend to" basically referred to that I agreed to some of the things
he said. I don't know you, so I can't agree or disagree with him on you being
rich, stupid, or having no brain. Guy, however, I can comment on, because he
has been helpful and shared his knowledge on several occasions, to the benefit
of several of us here. I wanted to comment on one of your points. You
say that this is the kind of car that owners can not be expected to want to
do work on themselves. I think quite on the contrary. The type of people you
are referring to are the ones buying these cars new. Once they are used, however,
they become available to "the rest of us" who are genuine car enthusiasts
but can't afford a new one (that would be me...). Many of us who are "real
car enthusiasts" in fact like to tinker with our expensive used toys ourselves
- in my case it's also a way to make ownership and modification of this magnificent
automobile affordable. I do believe that you could have saved yourself
considerable sums of money if you did some work yourself, and/or evaluated the
performance of your stealer of choice. In any case, I'm sure the information
you have on your web site has been helpful to some people. To what extent these
problems are common i don't know, but I "tend to" believe that it's
less common than it could appear from your web site. That was my two cents,
350 lire, 22 Franc, 13 Kroner, 72 Yen worth ;)
Big-T (1995 740i) <email address on file)
Norway - May 18, 2001 at 23:49:20
Axel's reply: Undoubtedly, I could have saved some money had I been able to work on the car myself. However, just because a car is used does not mean it should fall apart to the extent that it can only be owned by someone capable of being it's personal mechanic.
Sorry about all of your problems with your 7...
I have found that not one car is right for everyone, that is why they make and
sell so many different ones. Hope you find the one that is right for you.
USA - Sunday, May 20, 2001 at 22:42:31
Axel's reply: Then I guess this car was not "the one" for JK, Oliver, Rick, Jimi, Jeffrey or Barry either.
Guy responds to "747"
ROTFLMAO!! Good for you 747! Yes, I definitely
can be construed as the "pyhorreal man w/no working brain", at times.
It wasn't my intent but your unexpected analysis is on point none the less!
I needed a good laugh today and I thank you!!! I'm working now and just
checked in the boards a few minutes ago. I promise to respond to your message
later tonight though, as some thought will need to go into it.
Guy S. (two 1992 750iL cars) <email address on file>
USA - Friday, May 18, 2001 at 19:10:00
To everyone who makes the time to read this.
To begin with lets lay down some ground rules for the subsequent discussion which may or may not follow.
1. First Rule of Fight Club is, you do not talk about Fight Club.
2. Second Rule of Fight Club is, you do not talk about Fight Club.
Im a simple man with a narrow written vocabulary, so if you expected a flambouyant dissertation, youll be disappointed. I like things to be uncomplicated. Generally all our problems stem from the obvious we cannot see, or the small which we perceive larger than reality.
Axel, nor anyone else, is owed, nor will they receive an apology from me for my remarks toward Axel regarding his experience with his car or the other poor unfortunate souls whom he has sheltered at his Gospel Mission. Am I unforgiving, rude, vulgar, insensitive? You betcha! When people demonstrate a power to cease to use their cognitive abilities and instead throw money at a problem hoping for its extinction, why should anyone give them sympathy? I still maintain he is a stupid 750iL owner. Axel is a highly successful man in his given profession. He must be to be able to afford these kinds of repair bills, and to live in the home viewed behind the car in his pictures. But Axels bane lies with his obvious refusal to learn. Axel didnt become successful in his profession via ignorance. He had to educate himself to whatever extent to become the man he is today. Axel now has sufficient means to pay for others to look after a car he drives. He repeatedly visits these people without acquiring the knowledge to know what the problem is, what is its source, and what measures were taken to remedy the problem, and how to we prevent or prolong the advent of failure in the future. Axel feel a homeowner doesnt need to be a plumber, an auto owner to be a mechanic. His analogy of a passenger to hold pilot skills isnt correct as a passenger is not in charge of the plane to begin with. A homeowner is in charge of their dwelling as a driver is to his car as a pilot to his plane. The homeowner, driver and pilot must all have knowledge outside of the specific tasks of normalcy in order to be proficient. When I flew A10s in the service, I knew the tertiary electrical and hydraulic systems as well as the crew chief. If I couldnt tell the chief what was going wrong and help him pinpoint the cause of failure, he would spend more time troubleshooting than required. It was my ass up in that plane so I routinely watched the crew repair my plane, there were actions while flying the plane simply to improve the reliability of the plane. Theres no curb up there to pull over to when something goes wrong, so I had to know the work performed on my plane was good. This gives pilots confidence in their platform so they have no reservations of pushing the performance envelop.
An illustration if you will. There is no hot water in the home. Its late and there are no repairman available to fix the problem immediately. There are 2 courses of action. 1. Do nothing, and everyone either takes a cold bath, or doesnt bathe at all until a repairman can be obtained. Or 2. Troubleshoot. Check main breaker to make sure heater is getting power. Using a multimeter, check to make sure the thermostats are switched to the proper element (if it has more than one) and check to see if the heating element is broken.
Now everyone has a first time with a water heater. Yes you may call out the plumber to fix it. But while he is there you start the education process. You see the troubleshooting process the plumber uses to determine what is at fault. Turns off the breaker, tests the thermostats, and elements, drains water from tank, changes defective electrical part. Refills water heater, turns power back on. A qualified plumber will tell you that thermostats and heating elements are expendable items, however, elements are significantly higher in failure rate so having a spare set will reduce your downtime significantly along with changing both elements at the same time as they both have the same time in service which builds reliability into the heating system increasing the mean time between failure further still. If the homeowner was watching they could see how it was replaced and maybe do it themselves. That way only 2 hours is lost, including heater warm up time, as opposed to waiting for the repairman
Heres our man Axel in motion. Master suite shower is cold. So go use one of the guest bathrooms. Have the butler call the repairman at next available opportunity. Repairman comes to the residence, while Axel is securing his financial independence at the office. Axel sees nothing, learns nothing, and 1 week later he finds his shower is cold again. Now hes pissed off because the repairman was just there the week prior. What the hell is going on here, I pay people good money to fix a problem only to have it rear its ugly head again in my face The repairman comes out replaces the other heating element. Next week same fault recovery process, and the repairman has to come back out because the wiring terminals on the thermostats are stripped from the last time he was out. Axel doesnt know this because he still isnt educating himself on the root cause of failure, insuring his lackeys are qualified for the task, or learning about preventive maintenance and now the boneheaded plumber sells axel a new thermostat, which the plumber himself damaged and a new set of heating elements. HOO HOO. Plumber says to himself. Axel is a good customer for business.
This little farce is a drastic oversimplification of his car troubles but the same theme runs true. Axel repeatedly doesnt learn about the car from any facet. All he wants is to sit down and drive it and expects everything to perform flawlessly. This is why he and owners like him are stupid. Axel has never asked for help from anyone on the e32 board. His interest lies with developing and maintaining a website dedicated to inform people of what a lemon the e32 750iL is. He educated himself adequately to develop and tailor the site to accomplish his goals. If he were to exert the same energy into understanding his car, he wouldnt have so much difficulty with it.
Alot of e32 board members do not work on their own cars. Physical hand tools are not required like the plumbers multimeter. But they have power in knowledge. They tell their maintenance people what to look for in a detail specific manner, and they have the knowledge to know if their mechanics are lying to them or not. Unfortunately, most mechanics and owners have no concept of preventive maintenance to build reliability in the car. How many times have I read about fuel pumps and cars going into limp mode or left them stranded. As soon as a 750 crosses 70K miles your on borrowed time. Yes some fuel pumps have been known to go 200k but thats rare. Better change them while the old set is still working, and insure your car will be fuel pump trouble free for another 70K. Same thing goes for front suspensions, brake and LAD accumulators............
Axel made a statement regarding my facts being wrong and yes alot were. I never actually analyzed his data until today, but relied on my brethren to form my comments yesterday. Facts aside my assertion of Axels uneducated character still rings true.
Now to the data.
Axel the car you purchased had some interesting signs before you bought it. And they are not the cars fault.
Repair order # 7 shows brake pads replaced, and then pads and rotors replaced again on #12. A meer 11k miles later??? Unless this car was tracked, had the shit driven out of it, or had lousy pads installed there is no reason for pads to wear out so quickly. Maybe not but this sounds too weird because the pads installed at #12 lasted twice that long.
Stemming from #17 from the mysterious window implosion, there are 3 more repair visits to clean out the glass from the car, rear shade, etc. How many times does it take to remove the deck, shade, seats, etc to do a good vac job???
The notes for #42 are unique to this car. Rack and Pinion work? You have variable servotronic power steering my friend. But this is before your time.
Up though 70k I consider fuel pumps, water pump, batteries, radiator hoses, alignments, leaky oil o ring, an another set of brakes all standard fare.
Cooling problems seem to be chronic with this car starting from #52. A fan clutch, radiator, piping, are not uncommon for 70k mile car.
By 80,000 brake booster, LAD shocks, front suspension, brake accumulator, miscellaneous broke shit. All perfectly normal for this car. You just pay a premium by having others do the work. Especially those rear self leveling shocks. They only cost 250.00 new from 3rd party parts houses, and they are genuine Boge Sachs replacements. Im guessing by the 4400 bill you paid nearly 700 each for them or more.
In parts alone 500 for LADs, 250 ATE brake booster, 75 for alignment, 200 for LEMFORDER upper thrust arms with bushings, 25 for belts, 20 for oil and filter, and another 250 for the misc seals, switch, jets. Well under 1500 in parts. Im in the wrong business. 3000 in labor. And I could have all this work done in 16hours. Thats a rate of nearly 200/hour. Axel I want to be your personal mechanic from now on. You wont even have to pay for travel time and air fare portal to portal, Ill take care of that at no additional charge.
#66 is interesting, says here an auxiliary water pump replaced. What the hell is that, no such thing as an auxiliary water pump. Only one water pump. Now there are 2 pumps on the windshield and headlight high intensity washing system FYI. The water pump had been perviously replaced on #38. And on #67 you had to take in for the thermostat. Did you know the lower radiator hose clamps onto the thermostat housing which is bolted to the water pump you replaced 2 days earlier. Of course you dont but in order to get to the water pump the fan, fan clutch, radiator shroud, and maybe the radiator itself has to come out? Why didnt they just put in a new thermostat when they did the water pump change?
Now your misery really begins. Your not happy about the CD changer and a total of 6 trips and money to finally get you a new machine, non of which is the cars fault. BMW doesnt do CD changers or head units.
Coolant woes are abundant through #80. These yahoos are just replaced the broke shit and havnt found the root cause of the overheating problem. And your paying through the nose each time.
#77 and #76 I cant believe you took the car to a mechanic to change some light bulbs. Can you say I am the epitome of laziness. Same goes for #56. Cant poor a little brake fluid into the reservoir?
#78 Fuel pumps again in only 12,000 miles. They lied, fuel pumps dont do this unless you ran the tank flat empty and burnt up the pumps. They require the fuel as a heatsink to keep the motors from overheating. Every wonder why the manual says its a 24 gallon tank but you only seem to put about 20 gallons in it when you fill it up??? The guage and OBC tell you well in advance to fill the tank. They just installed a new set charged you for them and found the problem to be a bad connection on a Mass Airflow sensor or DK motor.
Gotta go, will complete later
Guy S. - USA - Friday, May 19, 2001 at 18:17:02
Moving through repair order 80 through 104 covering 10k miles, there are numerous issues with coolant troubles, which began earlier on. A car requiring 2 radiators, one just 10k miles ago at 80k, hoses, coolant reservoir, and a radiator cap recall replacement at #87. There is no reason for this type of service history for a BMW V12 on the cooling system. Its not that complicated. Most likely I suspect the coolant is not european spec to work with the aluminum contents of the engine, radiator, interior heater core, and valves. BMW cooling system require a flush every 2 years maximum due to the aluminum content of the afore mentioned components while using Euro spec coolant. The coolant literally wears out after this time and corrosion will set in causing blockages in all sorts of places which certainly could be responsible for all the overheating this car has suffered. If American coolant like Prestone is used in this car then these problems would compound themselves much sooner. American coolant reacts with aluminum far faster than euro spec coolant. I no longer think the radiator cap being replaced right in the middle of the coolant problem history is the root cause. Basically everything except the engine, and interior heater core has been replaced already and still failures are cascading.
Axel I recommend you start budgeting for further cooling system components because the shop or shops your are using are NOT finding the root cause for these cooling failures. They are just replacing the broken stuff without knowing with certainty what caused it to fail. A radiator doesnt just get clogged, or develop a leak in the short period of times yours have been replaced without something else contributing to its demise. Also look at the water pumps, thermostats, more radiator hoses than a fleet of 750s use. Something is killing all this stuff in short order, and simply replacing it as it dies will not solve your problem. What item is common to all these parts?
Entry 104 says 2500 for a cooling system repair. Probably they just want to replace everything again in one fell swoop?
Do you know what kind of coolant is in this car???
# 92/94. Always get your tires balanced on a Hunter GPS 9700 machine. These are the best. Too much success has been documented on the various boards. You already replaced the upper control arm bushings on 97. Why didnt they replace the entire arm? Okay, you have nice bushings pressed into the arms but the ball joint at the other end takes everybit the punishment from braking, potholes, etc that the bushings do. These arms are probably the highest cause of failure regarding front end shimmy. Your tie rods and idler arm bushings are probably gone by now too and I dont see those items replaced as yet. BMW front suspensions are not as robust as say MBZ. This is what makes it the ultimate driving machine because the driver gets so much information transmitted through the car. And huge, chunky suspension components dampen that out.
The parking light and warning system issues, I dont really understand because there isnt enough information. Are you saying the parking lights sometimes come on and it doesnt at others? And the warning system is the display on the dash I assume, and it is displaying false faults or its not displaying any faults at all? I never see a relay mentioned in any of the parts that were replaced, or really clean light bulb sockets. Are they using nickel plated light bulbs instead of normal brass? Have your guys checked these all out properly?
These washer nozzel, pumps, hoses and such are easily replaced items. Just a pump moving fluid through hose to some nozzels. Its not hard to remove it all, clean it out with muriatic acid/ water solution and reinstall. Acid will react with calcium deposits to remove junk lining the hoses, clear out the nozzels pump. Somebody doesnt know what they are doing here again.
The AC system problems are stemming from a leak that they cannot find. This is why you keep charging it again and again. Did you go through a refridgerant change by chance? R12 to R134? FYI the caps are special fitting to connect pressure gauges to measure the suction and discharge pressures of the compressor. It doesnt cost anywhere near the stratospheric price of 2500.00. But you have to know where to get it.
Guy S. - USA - Friday, May 22, 2001 at 23:15:24
Finale, Part 3
One more thing before I close up. LAD shocks do not go bad after 30k miles. What kind of hydraulic fluid is in the car? Pentosin 7s should be in it. Open the hood yourself for once and unscrew the cap off the hydraulic reservoir. It better be green and not red. If it is green check to see if Pentosin 11s in installed. Pre 9/91 cars use 7s and Post 9/91 cars use 11s and the system components will not tolerate the wrong kind especially if the fluid is red. I cant remember which is which but I think 7s is mineral based and 11s is synthetic based hydraulic fluid. One or the other eats the seals of the non compatable system. If your shock are indeed bad again. Go to Eurasion, right down there in Sunny Los Angeles and get them for 250.00 each.
In closing, there are only supposed to be 2 kinds of owners. The rich and famous who dont car about the cost of repairs. And the broke like me, who care a great deal and decide to fix them ourselves. All I can say is WOW you have indeed taken a beating but I do not attribute this sorry tale all to the car. Yeah sure stuff is going to break and youve at least attempted to keep everything in working order, but I say again until you start educating yourself on this car you are going to continue to pour money down the drain on incompetent help. I know you dont want to involve yourself with the car, as it has no interest for you. Since you have taken this path of least resistance you are not entitled to complain and call the car a lemon just because you have spent so much in repair bills on it.
Havent you ever thought about why the flagship sedan series is so soft in the market? Why you find tons of 7s right after their 100,000 mile birthday? I need to ask you a question, now. Why didnt you buy the 100k warranty when you had the chance? Think of how much money you would have saved. Sure the car would be going back in to see the service department like its on a revolving door but at least you would have had some more of your money.
The only bit of advice I have for you is to quit being stupid and ask for help on the e32 board for a change. You seem quite good at lurking the boards. Now start printing out things good to know and go through the archives week by week instead of wasting so much time with your website. You seem to be quite literate with computers and such. Why didnt you find the bimmer.org website years ago?
So long Axel, and I will be the first one to jump on your help wanted post on the board. By the way I misspelled Pyorrheal. The h got misplaced. Pyorrhea is a medical/dental/pathological term meaning to excrete pus. Riggs disease is where its most commonly used. Some unfortunate patients develop a swelling of the gums because of inflammatory tissues around the tooth roots secreting pus. Those patients generally lose their teeth.
And to messier 747. Thanks again for the laugh and owners like Axel do not impact BMW engineers on subsequent generations of automobiles whether in the same series or the next. Obviously owners like me dont either because by the time I buy them they are already 8 years old. There are too many stories with BMW NA Ive read about on the various bimmer boards on 5 sites, to know that BMW NA doesnt give a rusty rats ass about anything.
So long fellas, man am I tired after this.
92 750iLs and soon to be 850Ci owner as soon as I find a nice cheap negelected model, that I can fix up.
USA - Friday, May 22, 2001 at 23:21:42
Axel responds to Guy:
Guy, I appreciate you taking the trouble to analyze my car, and I could respond to every point you've made where I disagree (and there are many things you've said that I don't agree with), but there aren't enough hours in the day to go there.
Try to look at the big picture. Let's assume for just a moment that everything you have said about my car is correct. Do you know what we're left with? "...BMW NA doesn't give a rusty rats ass about anything." That's what I want to see changed.
Axel - 1989 750iL (formerly a 1988 750iL owner)
USA - Friday, May 25, 2001 at 16:52:00